A human being offered to carry another human being across the river. The latter said, 'but how do I know you won't fuck me over?'. The former said, 'Oh, come on - I'll say I won't: 'I won't'. So the second person got on the first's back and off they went. When they got to the middle of the river, the first person robbed and began to drown the second. As he was expiring, the second person asked, 'But, you said you wouldn't fuck me over!'. The first human being said, 'But I can't help it, since it's my nature: I'm a scorpion!'.
Someone still reads Kunstler? After the 73rd iteration of the "world is ending, and the NASCAR-watching proles are too stupid to know it, unlike me, who is super smart and urbane because I ride a train to work that goes choo chooo" I figured out his style.
I read Kunstler for a while; then it became clear he was rather unhinged. On top of that, he's a rabidly unhingled Neo-Nazi level Zionist. This alone disqualifies him from any consideration as a serious commentator. Oh, and he claims to be a "painter" too. Check out his paintings sometimes. They suck as badly as his racist political views.
"rabidly [unhinged] Neo-Nazi level Zionist"
Never seen it put like that.
For a good long time, Ernie the Attorney was on Kunstler's (rather limited) blogroll. I always wondered how that cam to pass.
Oh, one more thing. Jonnybutter: you know what I said about writing comments that are superior to my posts.
Paulson's apparently from the mean streets of Barrington (Heights, Hills, whatever). It may be serendipitous that Pat Fitzgerald is already in the area.
I got some friends in Barrington. Didn't they film Breakfast Club at the Barrington High School?
I must say, those are the two most irrelevant ad hominem attacks that I've seen back-to-back in some time. Matter, if you said that he has a record of distorting the facts, that would be (IMO) an acceptable ad hominem argument. Your opinion that he's Neo-Nazi Zionist is irrelevant. Duff, I remember reading an article about Sandy Rosenthal in which she quoted Forgotston's advice that you have to repeat yourself to change mindsets. I understand being put off by Kunstler's arrogance (not that it would be relevant to his arguments), but the repetitiveness?
Actually, not sure if Duff's comment actually qualifies as an "attack," rather than an expression of opinion.
If I read an article in which Sandy Rosenthal quoted C.B. Forgotston I might need to have a bucket handy.
Also.. more sports-related impropriety from public officials this time involving... Eric Holder.
How on earth can anyone be labelled a "Neo-Nazi Zionist"?
Paulson's apparently from the mean streets of Barrington....It may be serendipitous that Pat Fitzgerald is already in the area.
Oh god, yes, Barrington is the Hell's Kitchen of midwestern upper middle class suburbs. It's just brutal. I mean, there's hardly anyplace GOOD nearby to board your goddam horses! Some people have to go all the way to Wayne! And just try to find someone to re-tassle your loafers! It's fucking Tobacco Road up there..
Re: "Neo-Nazi Zionism" - here is a link which should clarify this idea for you: http://www.shovrimshtika.org/gallery_item_e.asp?id=53
Given some of the things I recall reading on Kunstler's site, I suspect he's in agreement with the sentiment found via the link above.
As to whether it's relevant, bayoustjohndavid, it certainly is; if Kunstler expresses vicious racist opinions (as I saw on his site) it exhibits the overall problematic nature of his thinking.
Hence the reason I also commented on his painting; the sum of the parts is indicative of the whole.
A quick google search shows that he's vociferously pro-Israel, but I don't know if everybody who cites Hezbollah's stated intention to wipe Israel off the map can be dismissed as deranged. In general, I think that only a record of dishonesty is enough to dismiss somebody's argument out of hand. In more specific cases, I'd attach more weight to somebody's history. For example, in a debate over candidates for the Democratic presidential nomination, I can't for the life of me imagine why anybody would quote somebody who helped sink health care reform when he was the editor of a supposedly liberal magazine in the nineties and then went on to support the Iraq invasion. Of course, there was intellectual dishonesty involved in the first case. But, I can understand your point of view. Not trying to needlessly continue an argument, but I am curious about what Breaking the Silence has to do with Kunstler. You can ignore the tangential dig at liberal who quote Andrew Sullivan, nothing to do with this discussion.
Oyster, Pat Fitzgerald is in Evanston. I guess that's in the area, but what's that got to with Paulson?
bayoustjohndavid: you seem to be getting all mixed up.
To begin with your last question, the link was to Israeli graffiti, "ARABS TO THE GAS CHAMBERS". I never said it was specifically about Kunstler; it was illustrative of "Neo Nazi Zionism." For those who didn't grasp that concept. Kunstler is certainly a Jewish Supremacist in his thinking and writing on the topic of Israel, which gets him in the same ballpark.
(Lest you dismiss this graffiti as an aberration, I suggest you refer to Israeli opinion polls, which generally indicate that some 50% of Israelis are in favor of total ethnic cleansing of the Palestinians. Of course, in the Israeli media, this is euphemistically referred to as "transfer.")
Additionally, I might note that the idea of "wiping Israel off the map" was not stated by Hezbollah. Hezbollah is based in Lebanon; the statement about "wiping" has been (wrongly) attributed to Ahmadinejad, the president of Iran, which is a different country entirely.
Not to be too pedantic here, but a moment's research would reveal that this whole "wiping" statement is completely false. What he actually stated was that "the occupation regime in Jerusalem should vanish from the page of time." This is an entirely different statement, and hardly eqivalent. Furthermore, he was actually quoting Khomeini, who must have said it decades earlier. Since there was no outcry when Khomeini said it then, that is further proof that the "wiping" scare quote is pure fabrication and propaganda.
I can't speak for Oyster, but I think he was taking a break from vomiting by dreaming that someone like Paulson would be prosecuted. Of course, as you and he well know, that almost never hapens to the really big criminals. What they do tends to be legal.
Not that there's any more point to this than any argument the Arab/Israeli conflict, but I'm not getting all confused. O.K., one of the first links that I found when I googled "Jim kunstler Israel" involved the conflation of Iran and Hezbollah, but half the people who hear on American television do the same thing. Anyone who dismisses everything that such people say about anything can never realistically hope to do more than preach to his own chosen choir.
Yes, I was curious about what one piece of graffiti signified. I assume that you're aware of how some would characterize your stated reason reason for linking to it.
Boys, boys...your Freudian slip is showing.
David, Sandy Rosenthal is Irish Catholic. Other than that, I can't see even a peripherally relevant opening here that would allow you so much room as to stick not one but both feet in your mouth by attacking her and levees.org in such a smarmy, referential, school boy way.
Damn, that was simply stupid and brutally incoherent.
Jeffery, you are an established liar and shrill bed bug... right here on this very blog: http://righthandthief.blogspot.com/2008/12/shocking-disregard-for-facts-and-for.html
You can call me a lot of things if you like but I would appreciate it if you would drop the "liar" bit. It sounds a bit shrill, no?
Actually, it was the PLO whose charter stated that its goal was to push every Jew into the sea.
But if anyone thinks that Hezbollah does not have that same goal, then they really should not be taken seriously.
Editilla, I'll assume that this is a case of your humor sailing straight over my head, because I didn't attack Sandy Rosenthal in any way, and certainly not in a smarmy, referential, school boy way.
Ahh Daniel. So rigid in your dogma.
A moment's googling pulls up the PLO Charter, which I hadn't read previously. Nonetheless, there is nothing in there about "pushing every Jew into the sea."
If you had done your homework, you would know that in reality, the only people pushed into the sea have been the Palestinians. Yes, I've seen the pictures. Or did you forget about 1948, when some 700,000 were evicted from their homes at gunpoint by Zionist terror groups?
As to Hezbollah's goals, you are equally ignorant. Hezbollah was formed in response to the 1982 Israeli invasion of Lebanon. This is historical fact. Hezbollah's goal was to evict the Israeli invaders. They succeeded. Since then, Hezbollah's military goals have been to defend Lebanon. Something they did successfully in 2006. I challenge you to cite a quote by Hassan Nasrallah calling for all Jews to be pushed into the sea. Perhaps you can find one, but I doubt it.
(The ongoing dispute between Hezbollah and Israel involves a piece of land, claimed by Lebanon, called the Shabaa Farms. In other words, like the Palestinians, they are trying to recover their land from thieves.)
So in summary, I suspect you're either very young, not particularly bright, or such a militant Zionist that you are unwilling to confront verifiable facts.
Good Lord....has any one group of people in all of humankind's existance been more frequently blamed for every one of the world's problems and singled out for hatred than the Jews? Even the supposedly-enlightened Left (of which I'd always claimed membership on most issues) hates them with a passion. Slightly informative that these missives absolving the Arab world of any hint of responsibility for any turmoil in the last six decades comes not in the comment section of a post about the current Gaza situation or even one about Mid-East tensions in general, but in the comments following a post about the financial world. Because, of course, we know who pulls all of the strings in the finacial world, right?
The Arabs have been oppressed; how can an oppessed people be held responsible for any of their actions? Of course, the Jews kind of had a short statute of limitations on their own "Get out of jail free" card issued after some six million were "oppressed" in the gas chambers. But then, there's a whole industry built around contending that that never happened, either...
Would have been nice if Jordan and Egypt hadn't occupied the West Bank and Gaza immediately after the creation of Israel to use as staging areas for their invasion of the Jewish state...because there was your Palestinian state, right there. But then I guess the contention will be that mean ol' Israel would have invaded the West Bank even if there weren't all of those Arab tanks and armies massed on their borders.
[Duff, I remember reading an article about Sandy Rosenthal in which she quoted Forgotston's advice that you have to repeat yourself to change mindsets. I understand being put off by Kunstler's arrogance (not that it would be relevant to his arguments), but the repetitiveness?]
Well, David, are you actually that juvenile delinquent?
This is like watching a child trying to hide behind a coat hanger with a bucket of hot cookies behind their back.
With Jeffery I have come to expect such Dilettante Horseshit, but I just don't get it with you, David.
This is truly a surprise.
I really have enjoyed your posts for your attention to details.
But here, I really can't see anywhere in your reasoning that a sly comparison is warranted between the topic of this (oyster's post) post, a commentators' references to Kunstler as a repetitive extremists neo-Zionist whatever, and Sandy Rosenthal the director of levees.org and that group's presentation of facts regarding the Corps of Engineers failures to build our levees correctly?
BTW Do you remember the quote that Mrs. Rosenthal made of Forgotston's advice? I do. Plus it isn't hard to find --since as you point out and demonstrate: Google is so easy even a Narcissistic, self-absorbed Caveman can do it. Hell, even I can do it.
But, I think only fair that you cite it and the context of the quote here. Why? Because you brought it up. You used a totally unrelated discussion in an unrelated post here as a chance to stick it to the director of levees.org.
Sooo, what gives, gov?
Is it her Jewish sounding last name? Is it the fact that the Corps continues to restate and repeat incorrect facts by proxy commentary within our local media?
Please tell us just how Sandy Rosenthal fits into this discussion --other that the smarmy place you are attempting to leave her by Innuendo and Fallacy of False Correlation... not to mention Ad Mominem?
You really need to come off of what you're talking about there, since I beg to differ.
I am really not bright enough to follow your glib, ubber references.
As for Jeffery? Yes, well, anyone can go read the link I left above to where he lied here on YRHT, follow the links in those other comments where he lied on First Draft, and see that Jeffery is an established and proven liar.
I mean, this is Joe Friday stuff. Jeffery gonna call Joe "Nothing but the facts, Mam." Friday shrill?
Jeffery knows he is a liar.
No I will not let that dog lie.
Anyone like Jeffery that wants to try and stand between me and safer, correctly rebuilt levees, with Corps of Engineers Astro Turf in stuffed in their mouth is going to Hell.
What is worse though, is how Jeffery, and now despairingly you too, do not have the balls to face Sandy Rosenthal with your Ad Mominem attacks.
You just don't seem to have the guts to write your own posts on your own blog about your own problems with levees.org, or its founder, and their dependence on facts, repetition of facts and the connection of facing facts with German and Zionist Extremism.
No, you have to come over here, to one of my favorite places on the nola blog'0'reamery, and piss all over Oysters fine blog posts and try to tell us it is just raining?
Instead you would snipe at her, and by extension levees.org, like little bed bugs here on the backs of excellent posting by Big Mollusky.
This is really what bothers me here as much as the back-stabbing of levees.org: that you guys would come over here to to do your tree pissing. I come here every day. I love this blog and its blogger. But more than anything I really love the commentaries.
I don't go and pick on you stupid bitches behind your backs on other people's comment sections.
No, I confront you punks right here to your face, where you have it stuck up your own ass today.
And since this has not a knat's ass of relevancy to Oyster's post today, you've heard about all I have to say on such jailhouse punkery.
Go pick on somebody your own size --but you both had better bring your magnifying glasses, just like when you masturbate at home.
"Hezbollah was formed in response to the 1982 Israeli invasion of Lebanon."
Well, the first quick non-American source I could find was the BBC, who agrees with you on this point--"Hezbollah was conceived in 1982 by a group of clerics after the Israeli invasion of Lebanon. It was formed primarily to offer resistance to the Israeli occupation."
"Since then, Hezbollah's military goals have been to defend Lebanon."
A little bit of divergence between your account and the BBC's here--"Inspired by the success of the Iranian Revolution, the party also dreamt of transforming Lebanon's multi-confessional state into an Iranian-style Islamic state...Hezbollah's political rhetoric has centred on calls for the destruction of the state of Israel. Its definition of Israeli occupation has also encompassed the idea that the whole of Palestine is occupied Muslim land and it has argued that Israel has no right to exist."
Of course, the BBC is evidently controlled by the Jewish dogs, too...or they wouldn't have said this--"As Hezbollah escalated its guerrilla attacks on Israeli targets in southern Lebanon, its military aid from Iran increased.
The movement also adopted the tactic of taking Western hostages, through a number of freelance hostage taking cells...For many years, Hezbollah was synonymous with terror, suicide bombings and kidnappings. In 1983, militants who went on to join Hezbollah ranks carried out a suicide bombing attack that killed 241 US marines in Beirut."
I should just assume that you're yanking my chain and be smart enough to leave it alone. Duff criticized Kunstler for being repetitive, I referred to the article about Sandy Rosenthal to demonstrate that repetitiveness sometimes has its uses. One man's repetitiveness is another man's (or woman's) hammering home a point -- or something like that. God, I really hope that this another case of me being too dense to realize that somebody's joking.
Jeffery knows he is a liar.
No I will not let that dog lie.
Anyone like Jeffery that wants to try and stand between me and safer, correctly rebuilt levees, with Corps of Engineers Astro Turf in stuffed in their mouth is going to Hell.
Again, I have to ask, is that supposed to be in verse? Is there a musical accompaniment? If I am going to stand between Editilla and safer levees, I might as well be dancing while I'm doing it.
Ah Matter, so uptight with your hatred of Israel.
"A moment's googling pulls up the PLO Charter, which I hadn't read previously. Nonetheless, there is nothing in there about "pushing every Jew into the sea.""
I notice you ignore the "Note, however, that the PLO's translation sometimes deviates from the original Arabic " portion of the link you provided.
I also notice that you ignore the fact that the founder of the PLO stated that its purpose was to drive the Jews into the Sea. Of course, this is not important to Israel haters.
"Yes, I've seen the pictures. Or did you forget about 1948, when some 700,000 were evicted from their homes at gunpoint by Zionist terror groups? "
Wow you have really drank the Kool Aid havn't you?
I am well aware of the Palestinians who lost their homes in 1948. However, I am also aware of the 850,000 to 1,000,000 Jews that have been displaced from their homes in the middle east because of the Arab Israeli conflict. You, of course, ignore these people.
"I challenge you to cite a quote by Hassan Nasrallah calling for all Jews to be pushed into the sea. Perhaps you can find one, but I doubt it. "
So you are requiring a quote from one man to prove that Hezbollah supports the same goals of the PLO? Really? Don't you find that a bit disingenuous?
Have you ever been IN Israel when Hezbollah decided to start lobbing Ketushim into Israel from Lebanon for no reason other than to cause terror? No? Because I have. I left a Kibbutz and went further south the day before the Kibbutz went into bomb shelters.
Maybe you need to live through something like that before you consider labeling Hezbollah as a group who just wants to keep Israel out of Lebanon.
"In other words, like the Palestinians, they are trying to recover their land from thieves.)"
I see you still support the lie that Israel stole the West Bank and Gaza from the Palestinian people. The FACTS are that the West Bank and Gaza had been granted to the Palestinian people in the UN agreement that created both Israel and Palestine. Israel accepted the terms, the Arab nations did not. At the end of the war, Jordan and Egypt took the West Bank and Gaza and never gave those lands to the Palestinian people. Yet I do not see you being critical of them.
"So in summary, I suspect you're either very young, not particularly bright, or such a militant Zionist that you are unwilling to confront verifiable facts."
Wrong on all 3 assumptions (unless you consider 32 to be young).
I am 32, I'm confident I would win a battle of wits with you any day, and I am hardly a militant Zionist. I believe that both the Israeli people and the Palestinian people deserve the right to have their own nations. I think Israel could do more to reign in the settlers (and the actions taken against the settlers recently did help). I think Israel has it's fair share of blame to accept. I just demand that blame be shared all around AND that people accept that the creation of Israel and Palestine in 1948, while not perfect, happened and we must now deal with the reality of that decision.
Let me ask you a question, to gauge your intelligence. You state: "The ongoing dispute between Hezbollah and Israel involves a piece of land, claimed by Lebanon, called the Shabaa Farms." If Israel gave back the Shabaa Farms, do you think Hezbollah would stand down?
And do you think the Israeli's should have just not taken the Golan Heights and allowed the Arabs to use it as a strategic place to attack Israel from?
Wow, Editilla, I'm just a rube here, and don't know nuttin bout nuttin, but all I read bayoustjohndavid do was use Ms. Rose as a great example of sometimes you have to repeat things in order to get the rubes, like me, to hear them.
Sort of like the refrain of a song.
You might wanna shake your wadded up britches out a bit and loosen up.
I'm just sayin'.
Daniel, so in other words, you're an Israeli, and not much of an American. The propaganda about the "1 million" is standard non-sequitur bullshit. They left mainly due to the action of Israeli provocations, such as the Baghdad bombings and the Lavon Affair, to cite a couple examples. Keeps drinking the koolaid, boychik; you'll never be the mensch you think you are.
Matter: "Daniel, so in other words, you're an Israeli, and not much of an American."
How on EARTH did you gather that from what I said?
I was an american citizen travelling in Israel and I visited a Kibbutz in northern Israel. The day after I left, they went into bomb shelters.
But I guess if you can make wild assumptions (like I am an Israeli) then I can see where you might come up with your other distortions of the Arab-Israeli problem.
Maybe we should take these unfortunate comment threads to each other's blogs or emails, since they have nothing to do with the original post.
OK Beverly, I apologize to bayoustjohndavid. Really.
Jeffery is still a poo'bug.
Oyster is da'Big Molluski.
Editilla wants to know if waded panties would make good levee filler too.
I'm actually old enough to remember Paulson and Ehrlichman.
Many of our Big O's appointments have me tricked, but none more than Gerald Galloway: (pending) for #2 Army, Civil Projects... that would be the US Army Corps of Engineers. It would be like the way Chaney got himself appointed VP. Lots of credentials, lots of experience, lots of books, belly of the mfkn beast.
Sloooowwwwly I turn
Step by Step...
Inch by Inch...
Obama has frightened me with the idea that he will meet with our mayor soon, and perchance through some ghastly twist of the rope of fate (and politics) will end up appointing Nagin as, what, NOLA RECOVERY CZAR???
I just want him gone.
I want Larry Flint as mayor.
I wanna have fun for once!
And in the category of UberUberStanks, and something to really wad up your breeches about, CNBC has named Hank Man of the Year.
You've got to be kidding me.
That's doubly astounding, because Paulson isn't just a bad choice, it also contradicts most of the CNBC commentary on the bailout. At least, the commentary I've head on CNBC has ranged from the mixed feelings that I assume most rational people who aren't total idealogues have to condemnation. Kudlow praised couageous action when he opposed to bailouts.
Of course, you could argue that in failing to bail out Lehman Brothers he made the extent of the financial crisis become apparent a couple of months earlier than it otherwise would have. In so doing, he transformed a likely Obama victory into a certain Obama victory, so, by that logic, you could make a case for Paulson as man of the year. I'm expecting to hear that from Kudlow any day now.
Internet comments are starting to remind of my life before I stopped drinking. A couple of week's ago, I made a comment at We Could be Famous that was intended to s*** stirring, and it got totally ignored. I won't say that my fist comment was totally innocent, but I wasn't trying to stir up s***, just challenge a little. I guess the "total idealogues" characterization might be offensive to some, can't help it.
I really need to learn to preview comments, that should read:
Kudlow praised his "couageous action" when he was opposed to bailouts.
Makes sense to me.
CNBC is owned by General Electric (80%) and Vivendi. Paulson is Definitely their Man of the Year.
I mean I'm not saying there are any connections here with the bailout.
Or to Lehman Bros' bankruptcy settlements.
Naaaahhhh... I'm sure Paulson is an honorable and honest man. He worked on Wall Street, right? Invisible Hand and all...